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Where did Glucose come from in a prebiotic world ?

Adonai888 - 01 February 2017 11:42 AM - what about you quote the part of the papers that explain how glucose formed in the prebiotic earth ? just throw a few unrelated papers and say : look here, wont work.


citizenschallenge:   What about you peeking beyond your blinders?
You want to know why big shot?
Because it don’t make one (fudging) bit of difference to the reality that,
it started with hydrogen
by and by stars, 
then further atoms,
then molecules,
Then Earth and again base elements 
then conglomerations of molecules,
then organized conglomerations,
then complex organized units
then complex organized units that learned how to cooperate with each other.
The rest is history, er, evolution.

All those stages and many not listed are demonstrated through countless examples.
That every detail has yet to be enunciated, 
doesn’t make the fundamental reality of the fundamental march of evolution any less valid.  

Besides, on top of that - What do you have to replace this beautiful exquisitely detailed, if not absolutely complete, storyline with?
a bunch of inconsistent blind guessing (I should have used "contrarianism"), such as that stuff you keep posting?

so I will start (apologies if some have already seen some of these)

first some reference material

http://www.crispian.net/PTIR/Nonsense.html (interactive link with explanations - they are very funny!)

and --- targeted at the anti vaxxers, but applicable to all the DK'ers out there

Dealing with people who believe they understand God’s Will and that they are actually God’s Warriors on some holy mission.  This comment came from over at CFI and got me started...

“Early genesis stories tells us earth was created for mankind by the gods.”

                         My wise ass, but dead serious and defensible, response:

So what?  Mother Goose told us the cow jumped over the moon.  What of it?

~~~~~~~~~

A few opening thoughts, be interesting if anyone has anything to add or share.

The Bible is a collection of books written by people who were trying to understand their place in the bigger universe and to consolidate a stable society.  The Bible was a great help.  It even has many truths in it, but I dare say most all fit under the category of Personal Truths, Community Truths and NOT Universal Truths!

Perhaps there is a God behind all of this wonder around us, but for human’s to presume that this God would be fixated on humans is ludicrous and as egomaniacal as the human mind can imagine.  Even crazier is to presume that we petty self-centered humans could be capable of actually grasping any real God of Creation and Time, Life and Love!

The best we can do is Shadow Plays, and our grand “Holy” Bible is but one human attempt to add some form to the ineffable.

It’s great in it’s time and place, but it is certainly no guide to understanding the physical universe that we were born from and that we will fold back into.

And it certainly wasn’t created for us, though humanity has certainly learned how to consume every resource it has to offer.  We will be leaving the stage sooner than most imagine, then time and tide will continue, the sun will rise and fall, and our Earth will cope with this latest insult in it’s time honored way.

samyaza - 17 November 2016 08:19 AM
I wonder if there are some German humanist here. I’d like to make friends and get in touch with the humanist association.
Most people from my place abroad socialize within their religious group. But that’s out of question for me. I hope I can enter the local humanist community, so I won’t be alone in a foreign land with no friend.
~~~~~~~~~~
CC responds:  "Might I suggest Victor Venema.  He impresses me a lot and I decided to give him a little more headline space so I hope you don’t mine me starting a new thread to respond  http://www.centerforinquiry.net/forums/viewthread/18938/"

Perhaps it'll help steer a little more American visitors to your site.  I'm hoping samyaza, may show up here to say hello.

The Man in the Mirror

28th October 2016

Donald Trump is not an outlier, but the distillation of our dominant values

By George Monbiot, published in the Guardian 26th October 2016

What is the worst thing about Donald Trump? The lies? The racist stereotypes? The misogyny? The alleged gropings? The apparent refusal to accept democratic outcomes? All these are bad enough. But they’re not the worst. 

The worst thing about Donald Trump is that he’s the man in the mirror.

We love to horrify ourselves with his excesses, and to see him as a monstrous outlier, the polar opposite of everything a modern, civilised society represents. But he is nothing of the kind. He is the distillation of all that we have been induced to desire and admire. 

Trump is so repulsive not because he offends our civilisation’s most basic values, but because he embodies them.

Trump personifies the traits promoted by the media and corporate worlds he affects to revile; the worlds that created him. He is a bundle of extrinsic values – the fetishisation of wealth, power and image – in a nation where extrinsic values are championed throughout public discourse. His conspicuous consumption, self-amplification and towering (if fragile) ego are in tune with the dominant narratives of our age.

As the recipient of vast inherited wealth who markets himself as solely responsible for his good fortune, he is the man of our times.  ...

http://www.monbiot.com/2016/10/28/the-man-in-the-mirror/

First lady Michelle Obama Speech Today : (she doesn't use his name once) --- tape has 'shaken me to my core'
Michelle Obama's EPIC Takedown Of Disgusting Treatment Of Women
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiVnRxt6I8A

The bandwidth is very limited: lenses are made with germanium which has its own response curve

You will see that the camera response encompasses little or no CO2 emission band. So what do you see if you heat air to 450°C

- not a lot unless the hot air hits something

What do you see of emissions from co2 - not a lot!

 molecules:between the hot air gun and a sheet of paper there appears to be no heat but the paper is 400°C

Air does not radiate much at 8 to 13um so the camera sees nothing (a thermal imaging camera would be pretty useless if all pictures were fogged from the air radiation)

How about water vapour

note steam is not visible

A video of same

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=l3t9XeTIA1w

So air is invisible and water vapour is invisible in some thermal imaging cameras. So all these people who keep measuring sky temperatures need to know the IR bandwidth of their thermometers before they can state there is no measurable downward radiation.

AIR sky picture with some spots added. Note that the camera bottom limit is -40°C 

Note clouds contain water droplets so do radiate within the bandwidth of the camera.

Another important item about thermal imaging is you cannot just point a camera at an object and measure its temperature. you need to consider emissivity and reflectivity. Watts points a camera at a MMT air temperature unit and says "look its at the same temperature as the wall". This is not true. It may be simply reflecting local temperatures.

Emissivity affects the measured temperature of a non reflective object but the temperature shown will change with the objects temperature

A reflective object will mainly reflect the temperature of objects around and temperature shown may have nothing to do with the actual object temperature

In the my industry we simply spray all items with a thin coat of matt acrylic undercoat to remove reflections and equalise emissivity.

some people maybe aware of "QualiaSoup"

He has a youtube channel and produces some excellent videos in critical thinking, true scepticism and related topics

anyway, two that I think are particularly good - and have helped me organise my thoughts enabling me to sift through the morass of cr4p out there are

and

very useful as I am NOT a scientist and often have to examine the rhetoric and multiple logical fallacies used by deniers

take 2 screenshots a few seconds apart (easiest to do is capture video and select frames for choice content!), trim to ensure only similar areas covered. add side by side in photo editor - you may need to swap left and right depending on how you view them.

I find using crosseyed viewing easier. look at picture look cross eyed until a clear 3rd picture is seen in middle of 2 originals - this will be in super 3d (long baseline)

Here is one I did earlier x-eyed version: